Involuntary Termination
By now half the “world†knows that I no longer “work†on deviantART. I can assure you that this is not some cruel practical joke. Many probably wish it to be one but, unfortunately, it is not.
What I am going to do here is offer up a small explanation, of sorts. Due to pending legal issues the specifics of the entire story are unable to be published by me.
This is a small explanation regarding the events leading up to the involuntary termination. I offer the truth, nothing more.
A few weeks ago I started dialogue with Angelo regarding some serious business matters. A number of issues that I had with deviantART, Inc. were bothering me so I thought it pertinent to make an attempt to remedy them.
I sat down and drafted an email to Angelo and cc:’d Andrew. It was a fairly lengthy email that asked a number of questions that needed answers.
The next day I received a response from Angelo, who asked if I were available for a phone call in two days. I wanted to know the specific subject of the call therefore I responded by asking for that information. Furthermore, I wanted to have a witness on the line in order to protect my interests.
Well, that was immediately shot down by Angelo. I was informed that since this was “intended as a confidential discussion†that witnesses were not allowed. Because of this I asserted that I wanted to know the subject of the call, as at this point I feared termination as a form of reprisal for questioning the very issues I did, or Angelo would hear from my attorney.
Ultimately, Andrew responded and asked a few questions and said that I could have a witness on the line when he called. It was a Saturday morning, one which I was greeted by a hangover, when Andrew called. We discussed a few things and then a day, or so, later he emailed me asking for further clarification of some serious business matters I alluded to in my email.
At this point I was getting tired of being given the run around because that is what it felt like. I sent an email back to Andrew, cc:’ing Angelo, outlining the majority of my issues, with a deadline of 10 days. If that was not met then certain actions were to be taken.
Eight days in to this I had yet to receive as much as an email, instant message, Skype or telephone call. I sent a scathing email to Andrew and Angelo exclaiming what a mockery of an “investigation†this was since I had not been contacted for my side of the story. In the email I stated that I needed to hear something from someone within 24 hours otherwise the aforementioned actions were to be set in to place.
I received a response around hour 22 though I was not at my desk therefore I did not read the email until shortly after hour 24. Since I had received a response I replied by saying that I was at my desk and I could make myself available for a phone call.
I went down to my car and received a phone call from Andrew, on behalf of the Board of Directors for deviantART, Inc., in which the first thing out of his mouth was that the board has decided to terminate my relationship with deviantART, Inc. A settlement agreement and answer to my email would be provided.
The conversation ended and I walked back upstairs to my desk, feeling like I was walking through Myst. Loaded up deviantART to see that I was a “deviant†rather than an “Admin.â€
Make of this what you will.
cowardly chicken-shit angelo… getting somebody else to do his dirty work…
Nothing more to say. “The truth is out there” dear yellow alien. You did what you could. In exception of my egoism, I wish you could get back, besides it seems impossible to happen. We have never met each other, or even a comment or anything else. But bro, I’m with you and if you are leaving, let the bad moments there and stay with the community, the REAL community, in your heart.
Hope that things takes the best path.
Good luck.
Best regards,
Hugo Benamor
interesting stuff indeed… i await the next moves with bated breath. it would seem someone is about to receive the probing of their life ;)
–
poll: To fill in the time during the current “state of unrest” i mostly plan to…
Well, sad sad sad ….
i would like to know all the issues and questions you asked, but as you said, the entire story is “protected” by legal stuff
So, did you get a response to your email?
Is it the NDA binding you, or something else?
Will you go to court?
Am I asking too much? :)
I don’t normally do this.
Some horrific things happen in this world. Some horrific things are happening that are far more deserving of my attention. But right now, I want to shift the focus. Out lives are fairly enjoyable, and in the clear for the time being, so let me author this, and then let me get back to my regularly scheduled isolation.
Just this evening I saw a deviation that eloquently said what I had been trying not to say all this time: deviantArt is an art community, nothing more, nothing less. It has a culture and a way of life that has the power to power to permeate others. How easily I used the word ‘deviation’ in the beginning of this paragraph, implicitly knowing you’d understand what I meant. It’s something powerful that can make that sort of thing happen, and it’s not something I’m sure I’m qualified to write about. But I’m going to try.
Negative One ( If you don’t care about me personally, you can skip this)
Back when I joined deviantArt in 2002, I had previous little intent other than to try and show off, get known, make brilliance. I saw the explosions of inspiration that came from the people on dA, and I wanted to be a part of it. So my first pieces of art were gaudy, talent less things, over inflated in size and value. And then a funny thing happened. Life intervened on my ‘art-making’ phase, and through it all I would observe, draw in inspiration, and through routine alone, sit down at the end of each day and immerse myself in Photoshop and the GIMP, Arts & Letters, Illustrator, Blender, Terragen. Something t of habit made me want to understand, to keep trying, keep forcing ideas through, keep making something better. Slowly I stopped caring about comments, and started caring about progress. I wanted to learn, and I wanted to create. And so I did, and I posted, and posted, and posted. Through triumphs, failures, breakups, senior year of high school to my second year of college starting this September, I pounded myself with a drive to create art, something that could be understood and appreciated.
All the while I would lurk if I weren’t posting deviations, sometimes writing condescending comments about how “it’s not the community I’m here for, it’s that artâ€. I’ve never once posted in the forums, answered a poll, shouted in a box, et cetera. I received a few comments, I gave a few comments. I participated in a few collaborations. Oftentimes I would browse deviantArt for an hour to find one piece I liked, +fav it, and sign off. That, I felt, was my minimum requirement to the community.
Antithesis
Do you see the flaw here? I wanted my art to be understood and appreciated. By who? Myself? Barely. I wanted the community, even when I lambasted it for being what it was.
I’ve read about you, Scott, and what’s happened. I’ve read about Angelo as well, trying to understand as much as I could, while feeling like it didn’t matter to me personally. I saw the state that deviantArt is in right now, and I decided with chaos at the reins I should get my art off deviantArt post-haste. So I did. I went through my galley saving all my pieces, in case I had lost my original working files. As I did, I looked through each ones comments, just seeing what little impact I had made over the years. A few comments here, a few favorites there. But something in my rose, and I couldn’t help but cry over all that had happened over the years: to me, to my art, to deviantArt.
Then I saw that deviation. You know what I said earlier about deviantArt culture? Well, it applies to the word ‘deviantArt’ itself. When I use that word, I don’t mean deviantArt, Inc., or even http://www.deviantart.com. Not any more. To me, now it’s you. You, me, us, them. The people dedicated. The lives changed. The hope renewed. Sure, we’re like any other community online. We have our share of anime zealots and furry proselytizers, religious apologists; we have our share of angst-ridden goth punk techno ravers and people who have never used correct spelling, punctuation, or grammar in the whole of their short, meandering lives. But you know what? Fuck if I care.
I thought to myself tonight, we need to realize that we ARE deviantArt, and we need to understand that in a very real way.
http://www.deviantart.com is *not* a community and never can be. It’s one set of servers, catering to the rest of the users. Any person with enough power and intent can hit precisely one switch, and it’s all gone. Just like that. It’s a control structure. Look familiar?
A system that acts as a pyramid is meant for royalty alone - it can never be a community. You know what a community *does* look like?
Tight-knit. Integrated. Equal. So where am I going with this? Good question.
Combine Bit-Torrent-like technology, a few coding miracles and the spirit of a dedicated art community, and you have something far larger than one website could ever be. Imagine a community where each individual’s contribution makes a difference, no matter who they are or how popular they are. Imagine a community where the mechanism operated individually of the spirit. Imagine a community where everyone who made a contribution made a difference.
Someone who provided for the community could be provided for.
Someone who earned recognition for the community would be recognized themselves.
I’m not sure I fully understand where I’m going with this; but something in my mind tells me that there is a way to decentralize an online art community, openly, transparently, and with everyone’s involvement.
The art would get to the people who wanted it.
The feedback would get to the people who needed it.
The only centralization would be a status and tracking server, as well as information for all the community: whereabouts, happenings, news, and of course, art.
You may say I’m a dreamer.
http://www.deviantart.com cannot be more than it is at this point, I feel. It is entrenched in itself, in policy and secrets and stupidity. It very well may fail. But we can’t use a system to fix itself. The result will only be as strong as its weakest link. So maybe the community can help me realize this dream of mine. An art community without borders.
THE IDEA THUS:
The Community
[ FORUMS ] discussion etc.
[ ARBITRATION ] settling artistic disputes.
[ THE COMMONS ] Handles facilitating people searching for a particular (ART-RELATED) interest and work to sub classify artwork.
[ CENTRAL ] Website with instructions, FAQs, Wiki, developer’s source, etc.
The Mechanism [ 100% Open Source ]
Step 1:
All art is categorized. All at is subject to standards of file-naming conventions.
Step 2:
Dedicated mirrors are set up worldwide for the catalog of all art.
Step 3:
Client and feed readers are written to take advantage of the mirrors.
Step 4:
Submissions would be posted to a centralized server, which is tasked with cataloging and decentralized the submissions.
Step 5:
Centralized server handles received comments on art and sends those to decentralized as well.
Thank you for your time.
Thank you, Scott.
There are worlds beyond this certain shade of green.
This is why I have supported you from the beginning, Scott. Not only have I never seen you be anything less but a wonderful leader in the community and an all-around great guy outside of it (I love the stuff you put up here on your blog!), but I also had a feeling that this was exactly the case of things. I maybe didn’t have all the details, but I had my hunches, and they were certainly right. I guess I’ve had the unfortunate opportunity to have it happen enough to me that I can sniff it out maybe.
I don’t know why people do these things in our world, especially in America. It shows how corruption can take over anywhere. In this country, we may not have the best of things (you can’t get anywhere almost without a degree, for example, even if you have skills beyond what you’d get at college). But I digress. Here we are with the ability, more or less, to be “about equal,” but there are just some who can’t stand it. They want it all, and they want it all now. It doesn’t matter who is affected in the process–man, woman, or child; parents, siblings, or spouses.
When I see people like Angelo do these things, I just remind myself of my own beliefs: that sooner or later, they get what they deserve. Sadly, those they affect may not always see it or find out about it, but they do reap what they’ve sown. Call it karma, call it the effects of the Golden Rule, whatever, it still happens.
As I was busy doing something last night, I was actually thinking on this situation, and while my heart really, really goes out to you, I decided I’d step back and look at what this might be like on the other side.
The glitz seems one thing, but then I thought about the fact that Angelo has been doing this since he was a little boy (why his parents didn’t step in and make him slow down is a mystery to me), what with DMusic and his other, well, failed dreams. He’s still thinking and acting with a little boy’s irrational mind; he strikes at things before he thinks. It has already affected and will continue to affect his career.
And when has he had time to grow up? When has he allowed himself to? What relationships could he have possibly had all these years? He himself says he sacrificed such things for these business ventures. There are many like him, and it’s a sickness. People, the relationships you make with them, and just the base forms of humanity are so much more important than money and corporation. He does not see that yet. Chances are, he’ll see that when it’s too late to change things. Hindsight, you know.
So keep that as a bit of solace, as small as it may be. For now, things may be extraordinarily rocky and uncertain in a business you and Matt started (I hope that changes!), but you have things that he might never have, because he’s willing to sacrifice them for a quick dime or a bit of prestige. I guess that’s what’s helped me remain civil throughout all this, even when I haven’t totally wanted to be. I pity him for being so immature, even while supporting you and Matt.
What they did was … I can’t even describe my distaste. I started DeviantArt in 2003, not too long ago. I thought I’d submit a few things here a few things there and just.. not care in a way. I didn’t really understand it but my best friend had an account and I wanted one too. I must say.. I’ve never loved anything more. The people, the feeling of appreciataion, everything. And it’s because of your dedication, your hard work that I love this community so. DeviantArt is changing and I understand this.
But I came here to post my art and I don’t give a damn what the think they’re doing, I refuse to stop supporting this community. I think if I take my gallery down, I’m letting down other people just to spite the people who’ve never even looked at my gallery. I don’t see that upsetting people like Angelo and the other wannabe-deviants.
I think I’ve always been trying to help people out and support them but I plan on increasing my time spent here as much as I can in order to remind people of how DeviantArt was and how it should be. I hope your presence doesn’t fade and I hope that you can come back as President again. You’re so supportive and nice. I hope everything goes well for you, Scott.
xoxo
This sucks man! Can’t believe Angelo and others did this to you. I really hope you come back to deviantART. :’(
I already have my reasons to pull devantART through a rather lengthy legal process on grounds of aiding in willful criminal copyright infringement and defending an art thief. Jason Krause STILL owes me a formal public apology, even if I stay banned, and I know that the only way I’ll get even that is legal action. But this is the final straw. They’re extorting those that know the reasons behind your termination, which is also very illegal. I honestly do think a court case is in order, and I for one would love to be able to initiate it or see it done. My own problems aside, the dA administration are violating United States and international law, and MUST BE PUNISHED.
I’ve no idea what the legal situation is in the states, but I’d like to hope that you have some recourse in terms of being re-instated onto the board.
What’s really sad is that dA can never be the same again.
Perhaps one day when Angelo’s a bit older he’ll realise the mistakes he’s made - his world view at moment seems to be summarised by “the cost of everything and the value of nothing”.
Hope you’re hanging in there.
JP.
What can I say? It’s surprising how things like these can happen.
Apparently, Sotira is more than just a person “of questionable character”. The fact that he can outrightly lie to millions of deviants in the community (like saying he was a co-founder along with Matthew and yourself) and do all that crap to you further impresses the fact that he is unfit to run, or head any business entitiy, much less a community-driven website such as deviantART.
That man is full of himself.
A good leader will be open, honest, and will not push someone down (and maybe kick him in the nuts and spit on his face as well) just to further himself or his cause. He should lead by example.
You and Matteo did that.
Jark, hang in there man. The community needs you. We got your back (and Matteo’s too).
Sorry to hear that, terrible thing that happened and it’s all over deviant art, there’s at least three people on my devant watch that have petition’s running, I’m glad I was patient and read this here instead of trying to make sense of the theories that have been running around, thanks for telling us what you could!
Well articulated…keep up your strength, diginity and head held high.
Scott,
I’ve been browsing and lurking through the website for about a year now, since I first found it through a link on another art site. I’ve never felt the need to share my opinion about someone’s art, or poetry, or any other piece they’ve submitted. Thus, I haven’t yet signed up to be a deviant or any other such thing on other art sites.
On Monday, I was looking at the highest rated deviations and noticed something odd about a good number of them: they had some kind of yellow alien in them. Or they mentioned a yellow alien. Or were just tinted yellow. Now, I had seen a couple fads come and go while I was silently clicking the “Next” button over the months, furries and chubby people being the ones that stick out, but I had never felt something from the pieces that I examined. Not like I did when I looked at the “Yellow Alien” pieces. I felt depression, anger, sadness, a sense of pained existance. Nothing like I had ever felt for any other piece I had ever looked at on any other site.
So what did I do? I hurriedly devoured all of the information about this latest fad that I could, so that I might understand why, suddenly, all but two of the first page of favorites had a “Yellow Alien” in them. After some digging and reading of journals and comments that kept me at my computer screen for about five hours, I realized that the person (and persons, as I would later find out) that had created such an awesome outlet for art and inspiration had been “fired” and pretty much told to “Get Lost” by some no-name guy (I never much paid attention to the actual people unless I really enjoyed something did, and even then, it was only a quick glance at their profiles) in a place of power higher than his. That struck a cord in me.
The next day, I just continued reading all that I could about this “Yellow Alien” and all the stuff that had happened in such a short span of time. Finally, I realized that it all just sucked. It was an indeciency that someone would do this to another person who had brought so many people such an outlet that gave them, and many others, inspiration and.. joy.
So, I am pledging my support for you and your beliefs, and the beliefs of the rest of the community that has a home at deviantArt. And I’ve come to realize.. this “Yellow Alien” thing.. isn’t a fad. It’s a way of life.
Long live the Yellow Alien!
Well. I’d been gone for two weeks and just got home three days ago. Imagine my suprise when everything on the site had something to do with Jark. So I asked my friend Binary about it, as she had colored her avatar yellow. She gave me a link to a website that had information and screenshots.
As one deviant puts it eloquently, it was basically a hostile internal takeover. I don’t think I can ever forgive Angelo for taking over deviantART. He doesn’t care about the community, he doesn’t care about the art, he doesn’t care about the people that practically live on the site. I’ve found a few Ninja supporters, but they’re few and far between–mostly Jark, though.
Now deviantART is divided. How did that happen? Nice going, Spyed, you divided a whole community in half just by being tyrannical…
Annnnnyways. The site’s mostly on your side Jark, the teeny minorities don’t really matter.
I could feel somthing coming as far back as christmas, the website seemed to stop growing as in certain features where gone and the community spirit seemed to be being lost. Deviantart began to loose its “mojo” if you will, and now I can see why, when the creative aspect of the site is stiffled. I liked your idea of using taggs for site organisation and its ideas like those that kept deviantart as a website fresh. The community however felt like it was joining the site, slowly stagnating. Recently however due to the unfortunate events in which you where unrightfully dismissed from your place as president of your creation the community has thrown off the stagnation and rissen up. Deviantart as a website is stagnent, polluted with selfish commercial things, and has now become dissconnected with the community. How long the site can live with this connection severed I dont know. What I feel, as thousands of others do, is that you are the glue that bonded that link. Without you deviantart is dieing. I really hope that you do get your creation back, I cant begin to think of what it must feel like to have somthing you made, you spent time on and loved to be ripped away from you by some powerhungry, well lets leave the insults there before I become too uncivilised.
I hope that you get your website back, and as dissolvegirl said here (http://comments.deviantart.com/5/6101785/157774762) as a question to spyed. As CEO of a company whose employees and customers have banded together in a show of love and community against you and your actions, how does that make you feel? Its just a shame that he wont read it, because he doesnt care.
i say you call Gorman and setup the new deskmod.com ;)
Hey Scott!
I’ve never really been firmilliar of what has gone on “behind the scenes” at DA. But resently it’s been pretty hard to avoid.
The stories between you and Spyed differ a bit, and I wouldn’t know who’s telling more of the truth. It’s hard to tell over the net, since anything may or may not be true facts.
But you seem to be the one who has greater intentions about the site.
That guy ~quadriphon had some idea about a new system that would be the total community on the net.
What I really was wondering is, will you attemp on making a new community with all the things you’ve learned?
I thought your idea of tagging instead of categorization was very interesting. Though, I think it would be a system parallel with a similar system to the one on DA. Not entirely the same as DA though, since it’s flat.
The categorization should be on different levels rather than a tree as it is on DA.
Alowing selection of medium and style and maybe on or two other category values. These should not be effected by eachother though. On DA you’ll have to chose medium to get into the “sub catagories”, as surreal. I might want to see all the surreal stuff, not only the ones under traditional art.
Anyways, I’m gonna stop my babbling here!
Good luck to you. I hope, that if DA goes to hell, you’ll pick up the old spirit of it and try to raise the flag proudly once again. uhm.. yeah, sorry for that =P
Although I didn’t get the chance to know you, I stand behind you Scott, and my hope is that one way or another things will work out for you and deviantART.
Hang in there! :)
I think you and Matteo should either bring back WastedYouth or something similar. A large portion of the dA community will follow. If you build it, they will come.
i am laffin my ass off.. i just noticed that the ‘messages’ tab on DA now reads ‘community messages’!
thats funny and stupid.. a] the company has no regard for the community or its will and b] they are MY messages, not the communitys!
wankers.
Two words: “Love and Peace!”
So you guys had a little spat (ok, maybe it wasn’t so little), but that’s still no reason for you to get fired. DeviantART needs people like you!
I repeat: NEEDS.
http://www.t52.org/
I have read the above link, and I have read all the forums I could on deviantART.com, I have read so much, my eyes ache from seeing and my head hurts from thinking.
I will ask you personally. What is now to become of deviantART? And you? Why this espionage and secrecy? Why weren’t the people informed? And why not take legan action eariler? And if you do take action (and I know you will) what will become of Angelo’s position? Why isn’t HE fired??
And even more so, where should my position be in all this as a member of the COMMUNITY? What am I supposed to think?
This whole situation has left me so speechless. Granted I wasn’t formally a member, I have been with this site ever since it started. i am just confused in every aspect of the word.
I would appreciate notification back, but can understand that you are busy.
Well it’s nice to finally read the truth of the matter, more power to ya Jark, rest well knowing the horde of the Jark side backs you up =P
why dont you sue? seems to be the best thing.
What comes around goes around. You dealt the bullshit in the previous years, and weeded out who you didn’t ‘approve of’ in the deviantART community with one-sdided stories. Now you’re fed the bullshit, and weeded out.
this whole ordiel has sterd up a war with deviant art…
i have a question… what were the issues that were bothering you?
You and I haven’t always seen eye to eye, especially in the early days of DA and DeskMod but Angelo always was and always will be a shady character. Bullshit artist extraordinaire, I experienced it first hand.
Hopefully he’ll get what’s coming to him.
Spyed is a wiener, nothing else to say.
man i dont even knowyou and i dont think thats right… i barly know deviantart as well… i thought it was just a bunch of freidns online talking to eachother on MSN or AIM wanting to build a site up and hit it big.. but wow.. i garenty they will let you bck in since everyone is behind you on this one…
wow, that’s pure BS if you asked me. I mean, you can’t get fired for asking questions and wanting to fix things… I’m sorry to hear about it all, and I wish you best of luck in the future.
[for a giggle, check out spyed's friend list... unless he's deleted me]
-Richard-
Well that sucks. I do commend you for actually posting your side of the events that led up to your dismissal. I’m sure you heard this one already a trillion times but things happen for a reason and in my experience, better and brighter things are always right around the corner.
Peace.
I don’t quite understand what happened >.> but I believe you didn’t do anything wrong there… what kind of a justice is that? o.O…I don’t think I can do anything, but if I can do anything, you can mail me or something ^^;….. I feel with ya dude ;-;
As I stated on deviantart, you have my support. =o)
i tried to email you but it bounced back so ill post it here,,,,
hey man… Im synthetik-dzignz on DA
I just wanted to shoot you a email with my regards.
I just heard about what went on and just spent a few hours reading about it on journal entries.
It is a shame that things went down the way they did and to be honest, I havent been going on devaintART much lately because i feel like it went from a website to a greedy corperation. I have never liked your partner, I always felt like he was way too “business” and not enough love.
I hope it all works out for the best but in my opinion… fuck DA.
I refuse to go back on DA until this resolves. I have always felt your presense on da from your coin phrases to your funny, humourous take on things not too mention it being your idea and im very big on peoples rights as creators. And now that i know the details i just dont feel comfortable about being on that site anymore.
thanks for making deviantART for it was what got me into the profession i have seeked and i wish you all the best in the future my yellow friend.
Hang on, so devART has a board of directors, making them a public limited company, correct?
Although they were in their rights to “fire” you, I can’t understand or see why.
-sigh- This is really horrible, what’s happening to you.
I’ve read so many journal entries over the past couple days and I know I’m probably 1 out of 1,000,000 (and 16 years old so I’m only a teenager. And hey, who honestly listens to teenagers?) but I want you to know that I’m on your side! Don’t give up no matter how tough it gets because people like Angelo don’t deserve to get away with what they do. You have many, MANY, supporters on deviantART and we’re all rooting for you!
All my support,
Jen Fruzz (ixzjenn07zxi on DA)
*Shakes head* I trust in you JARK. And we are all thankful to you for everything you have acomplished at Deviantart. Even if things are going downhill now, I hope one day we will all be satisfied with Deviantart again. Before deviantart, I had no where to place my art, writing etc. It would be a great loss for me if I had to delete all of my deviations and leave the site because I am not happy with how everything is now being run. I love DA and always will. But without you there, I believe their might be no hope for DA to return to it’s former glory. Trust me when I say that I am behind you 100% and am sorry to see you go. It just won’t be the same. We shall see what goes on in the next little while, if things dont change for the better, I think a lot of deviants will end up leaving. Then that fucking bastard Spyed will have no money and get what he deserves.
PS. We love you. And wish you all the best. You rock hardcore!!!!
-Swordexpert
How about we all raise our voice against deviantart and ask them to bring you back? and have a petition singed electrically by everyone who wants you back in deviantart?…. just a suggestion
I was a deviant on deviantart a long time ago, and jark, i respect you, and i wish you were back there.
I hope this resolves..
I’ve been spending the past while trying to find out what happened, when i stumbed upon this post..
You have my support jark.
as i am sure you have the support of EVERYONE on deviantart..
you were the birth of dA, and you leaving, would most likely be the death of it..
And i hope that never happens..
you always have my support!!
–
when i joined deviantART in 2001 i think it was, i wasnt the most liked deviant, even by yourself. and I left when my life, last year, took a turn around, i started fresh.
The community had its good parts, and bad parts, the administration being ok, you being a good part. Always getting back to me within hours of my notes to you..
Now thats dedication to your job.
Good luck in the future.
The DeviantArt community will progress well without you.
The DeviantArt community will progress well without you.
I found the email you sent to spyed online. someone posted it. After reading that i’m with you all the way. I’m asking for permission to post the address on the journals of people and groups that support you so that they know what’s going on and why you have been terminated.
Scott, really, I don’t know where the legal matters are going to go on the ‘legal issues’ with DA. I don’t really know if the resolution will be satisfactory to the community - Shyster like people tend to have Shyster like Lawyers.
Needless to say, I don’t know how to put this, but pull up the bootstraps and get an Alternative Art Site started…(I’ll email you later with some other thoughts I had today.
Even if you are ‘reinstated’ at DA, DA is not what it was when you and Matteo started it.
Consider what it was that you wanted when you originally spoke of the ‘concept’ that became DA. Then, think of all the modern technology that can make that possible…
finally i read what happened.
from waht you have said here in this “blog” i have determined that those guys you mentioned are jack asses, come over to AntiCubicle and I will take care of you.
It sounds as though, you, Jark, are beginning to give up…
Please dont give up…!
Even though DA has come together more so in this tragic event than ever, it is all for you, so dont think that it’s the end of the story book just because we are all talking umungst one another! It cant end that way…
and.. I know you must still be trying but,
it seems like you really want to just use this as the “Happilly ever after”, seeing your comments and all.
It is true, even I have noticed these things, but even still I’m standing strong beside you!
Please dont let us down, Jark…! We know you can do it..! Do something….!
Deviantart has quieted down some bit since Angelo did the “The corperation moves on”… because.. its just.. so completely.. numbingly mindless what he’s doing… so it makes us feel weak and pathetic…
it makes the -community- feel weak and pathetic what he’s doing….
I dont want to be weak and pathetic, although I feel I am right now… and I’m sure you dont want to eather…!
So I know we can make it through this… we just need to contenue having faith, right Jark? Please dont let this be “The end” of this little story in progress!
Democracy.
Please work.
Your explaination opens more questions than give answers …
The only one thing I have dude is: did you have a contract signed as a DeviantArt employed? or a file signed or a voice recorded with a policy about nefefits, limitations and advantages like Co-Founder of DA ? theres some file or something giving you therms and conditions like a Co-Founder or STAFF member?
being ´Senior member have that advantages or what? is there some contract or warranty signed when you are STAFF member or @admin — or being ^gallery director ??? iF I’m ^gallery director or @CopyRight Police man, what happens??
iF you read this message and consider reply, I will understand iF you reply me via E-MAIL to prevent confusion and revolutions . . . . . iF you think I will post, distribuite or make some use undesired with your answrs , you know I’m http://mclaranium.deviantart.com , I’m Jorge MartÃnez Dávila, 52-5551165710 in MX, I’m owner of saladamixta.com and childrencafe.com hosted in MediaTemple.net and I have a pseudo blog in http://spaces.msn.com/members/YorchMtzDv
You can exploit me iF you find I’m not serious or I’m a joker or something. And iF you don’t reply or you don’t read this …. more than the same. Thank you Mr. Thank you.
Jark,
I thank you for creating and maintaining such an awesome community.
If this doesn’t work out, we’re all thankful for you.
Hey Jark,
I first read this DeviantArt news on DJ-Designs site. All I thought was ‘wtf’???!!!111! But then I went to this site and it was true..
I’m not much of a DA guy but seriously, this is horrible…
Best of luck to you and great Community You and Matteo built up from scratch.
-Ex
…Start of opinion…
deviantART… Community? Corporation?
If "the corporation" or "the community"
correctly answer these questions:
http://oblivionxyz.deviantart.com/journal/6472445/
And make the correct actions, understanding its answers.
Then, maybe there could be…. hope?
For now, I define deviantART.com
is an internet “Portal†for various services offered by a "Corporation"
named deviantART, INC. These
services are personalized for a "Community" of artists and persons who
are interested in the arts or in the artists. This Community names itself as devianART.
Hmm. The whole issue goes agaisnt the whole spirt of devianart. It is when things like this happen, when people take money and greed over things such as respect that great projects like DeviantArt, fall apart. It seems clear enough to me that this is ridiculus, and that you should be re-added as a senior admin very soon. Good luck in your fight.
Odd that he would say ‘Board of Directors’, though when someone opens a conversation wth that you know it’s not going to be good. I must say that before reading this I had sided kind of with spyed, as I had not heard the full story. If this is true (every bit), you’ll have no trouble winning any lawsuit you file for wrongful dissmissal (or whatever they call it in the USA).
What I wonder is what happens if you win? The deviants would be happy but Spyed, Lolly and probably Mccann wouldn’t be too thrilled. And what kind of company can run with the board of directors feuding?
Good luck all the same, I hope a satisfactory resolution can be attained regarding this matter.
Dear Jark,
I haven’t been on deviantART for even a month. I was seeing all the “I support Jark” everywhere and wondering what it was about. I looked up your User page and came here to read your side of the story. I believe that you have every right to take legal action again the people who choose to cut you off from your creation.
I am going to stay on deviantART but I think that even the short time I have been on the site it has changed. It isn’t the same site I joined but there is still some merit. I would love to help support you moneteraly but as I’m only 17 years old an unemployed that is not a feasable option, so I give you my moral support in any action you take on deviantART and I hope that you will be able to return sometime soon.
Jessica (deviant: KaidaSerenity)
When I had first heard about what had happen I was in astonishment. The man who had created a place where I was able to share my art, enjoy other people’s art and meet new people without being judged was suddenly gone. If their is anything I think you should know is that all of deviantart supports you and we appreciate what you’ve created and can’t wait until you get what is rightfully yours back.
nothing angers the blood like a story about an average citizen getting bulldozed over by a cooperation. too bad about the gag order, i’m sure the details are engrossing.
even though, or maybe especially because, i have myself been unjustly banned for expressing myself through art, i can’t wait to see what happens. but you know how these big companies drag things like this out for years until the opposition dries up and blows away.
still, i’d like to see the little guy win for a change.
-ronaldo
In my opinion Angelo if a fucking cunt and should be strung up and hung. Cunt!
Hey Scott,
Fuck. I used to work as VP for an art-greeting-card company and I saw something similar to this happen- the drift away from community and art to corporation and personal power. Its not just ugly but it also is disappointing on a whole soul level. I hope you have a good support group real time while you are going through this (as I am sure your virtual one is enormous).
Also, if you need/want to talk to someone who lost friendships regarding this sort of thing before feel free to mail me revscrj@priest.com - stay strong, don’t give up and good luck to you.
I figured something out after reading this DeviantART should make a movie about all the things that happen. I know this is a late comment but pfft to hell with it. Scott you should make a movie then sell it. I’d buy it.
Peace!
Whoa, from the support youve recived I can only assume you were an awsome dude and deserved better treatment than this. Personaly I will remain…closed about my feeling untill after the specifics are realeased, since they can do alot to change a story one way or the other. But my heart goes with you dude.
Something like this was already suggested, but I want to add to it a bit.
An idea for a community based on distributed content. That is, each member is a server. Some kind of software could generate the website “frontend” on the client side so it wouldn’t need to be hosted anywhere. Links to things such as “browse deviations” trigger a search by date (for looking at new things)
SoftWare Client — Distributed over free p2p networks such as Gnutella
Art/Content servers: Each person is their own content server. You host your deviations (and those you’ve downloaded) when you’re connected.
Forums: Volunteer dedicated forum servers. These would store plaintext only
to keep space down. Formatting would be handled client-side. Software would be skinnable of course. With a couple of mirrors holding maybe 100MB of text each,
we could hold a lot of writing.
User Pages: Make your own, host it as well. Have a naming convention for these so people can find them, and make them one file so they’re easily mirrored if possible.
The biggest blessing/curse associated with this approach is a lack of a way to moderate the system. A user account system could be set up, and certain accounts could be disabled, but I think this necessitates some kind of central server, and thus some amount of expense. Up until this point, it can be done for free plus the cost of whoever designs it.
That little fuck (~Hitlersslave) photoshopped Scott admitting to “stealing comapny property”! http://www.livejournal.com/users/hitlersslave/ The latest entry is utter bullshit.
that sucks you were the admin I liked. I hope you win good luck :)
I’m still confused as to WHY they got rid of you. And what these issues you speak of are. I understand if you choose not to make those public but all I seem to be hearing is rumors about this and that. The entire story doesn’t seem to make sense.. why it happened o-o
…gosh…I just joined da less than a month ago; I’d never heard about any of this…It’s disgusting that someone who called himself your…partner, or comrade or associate or whatever the heck he wants to, would do something like that to you. People who want to usurp a person should at least find a less obvious way of doing it. What you did is amazing; deviantart is this incredible force that wows me everytime I see it. I applaud, commend, and otherwise congradulate you on your triumph with the site. I hope those pricks realize that taking away something you have more right to than they do is like a crime against God and sweat for a good long time before you beat the crap out of their lame excuses.
Good will for your future endeavors,
Bisexual-Artisan
I think that this will sort itself out in time, but, I’m just curious; isn’t this supposed to be an adult argument? The actions pulled and taken by the party against you seem a bit unjust and childish. I figured that maturity would take a front seat but I suppose I was wrong.
I think that you will pass this Scott, and don’t forget, we are all with you. :)
Wrong was of dealing with the matter. When an statement with such personal and emotional damage potential is likely to be made, it should come from the person who has taken that decision.
What do I call what Angelo did? Cowerdice. And as a result dA is in the hands of a ‘Julius Caesar’ type character. Per se, one who has many weaknesses but hides them with specifically chosen words.
As for the “new” administration. ‘Dictatorship’ is thew adjective that springs to mind. Come to think of it, dA is now like the old Iraq under Saddam Hussein: if you’re on its side, reap the rewards. If you oppose it, prepare to be “unofficially” insulted, ridiculed and banned in an unjust manner and in a manner that goes agaist policy and in essence the community.
As for ‘$josh’ we English have a very famous term for such people: wanker.
I haven’t been an ‘active’ member in awhile due to real life; etc…. every now and then I come and I lurk… reading this made me sad. I support you for what it’s worth.
I remember the early days. I wasn’t a member yet but I was there.
Jark you are a wonderful leader and inspiration to the whole community. Regardless of the actions you are taking in this matter..don’t allow the dream that was deviantART to fall.
Hiya Jark. I’d like to take the opportunity to congratulate you on all of your accomplishments. Unfortunately, I cannot be of much help.
I feel that it is overly disappointing that they terminated the contract between yourself and them. Spyed really played up on that one.
Perhaps you and some of your more “Trustworthy” associates could start up a new Art Community to rival deviantART. It wouldn’t take long at all for your loyal and committed supporters to flock to the new site either.
If there is anything that I can assist you with, please endeavour to contact me.
Can’t wait for the ‘keep the silence’ part of your contract to terminate.
The honest truth would be good for a change and let’s face is, Spyed is never going to tell us the full story is he?
couldnt have happened to a nicer guy.
you were always a dick, even back at customize. keep taking kids’ money so you can flap your flaccid phallus in court, that’s right up your style.
god it makes me feel good reading you whine. please, do go on. i love it. love it.
Dear me. This seems to be an awful pickle. To be honest, I thought up until now that this was all a lot of idiocy, some rumour over inflated into a gigantic outpouring of feelings. However, now, I feel completely differently. I must say, I feel dreadfully sorry for you, and wish you nothing but the best of luck in your legal proceedings. It shocks me how they can do such things to someone who has done so much for no more reason that helping out others. What an underhanded and despicable way of dealing with things. Again, good luck, Sir.
I’m not against you, I’m not for you. I am, however, shocked at this behaviour of your so-called friends. This is rather rediculous. Reduced in rank because of just asking certain questions is outrageous. Unless they have deeper motives and were planning on this all along, feeling that you were a threat. It happens, but it’s just plain wrong without explaining their motives to you. I do have an account and I really don’t care if they ban me or kick me off, I’m going to question them as soon as I receive the go-ahead from you.
I’m not able to support you through paypal, but I can support you through interrogating the current DA admin.
It’s a shame that the community that pays subscriptions, uploads their art isn’t listened to.
It’s obvious you are a huge loss to DeviantArt, that you are well loved there even still and wanted back.
Keep your head up, things have a way of working out and perhaps this was to lead you to something bigger and better, a more profound realization of the dreams you had when starting DA.
I hope all the best for you, because so much of your hard work and love for artists is an inspiration for us all.
I’m not sure if Jark actualy reads these but I have a few idea’s.
As from what i see you have a massive following and an incredible amount of respect within the community. The original source for devArt isn’t the most complex in the world… I program basic versions of the same type of internal applications devArt uses to prosses all teh pictures.
I say do your lawsuit and hopefully it will pan-out but if it doesn’t i think you can sink the original devArt with a clone type site you have enough of the devs to be able to cripple the orignal and they will eventualy colapse under the overwhelming exodus to go to a clone started by you.
You could possible put something in the starting proposal or agreement of all employs or co-owners that you cannot be forced out of teh company by any means unless you give up the company directly.
I know it’s very hard to start a company over from scratch, i’m currently studying buissness, but you have more support then you know
Well anyways Good-Luck
Servious
Hello jark, I’ve read and heard much about and I have been searching for this page for a long time as I heard of your unfair dismisal and wanted to learn more about it.
I agree that you were terminated for all the wrong reasons (if any) and would like to say that you have my support.
I point you towards this and this.
Spyed was always a background character. When DeviantArt was just starting form, he was in the background, refusing to endager his own reputation, money, and what not. Instead, Jark and Matteo built DeviantArt at the risk of it failing, and everything going wrong.
Funny though, that once DeviantArt becomes really successful, all of a sudden Spyed wants a piece of it.
I know this probably is meaningless from a person like me, but I truly wish you a best of luck. Backstabbing is beyong terrible, and what you are going through is beyond unmentionable.
I bid you good luck, and may all the best happen.
From what i’ve read about this whole thing, they were just looking for a reason to kick you out. Take your creation and sponge it for as much cash as possible with no care for the community. Then BAM they start feeling the effect and re-enable a few things (Search for example) In the hope that the community would be blinded to how they are being treated.
As someone said before this sounds like a dictatorship. Remove all who do not conform to every single little rule and regulation and give to those who do. What happened to free speech.. No scratch that.. What hapened to human rights?
My girlfriend is somewhat obsessed with DeviantART I used to get all worked up over her posting pictures of herself for millions of people to see. It took me a long time to accept it, but I slowly realised people who bother to comment are there to see art. Nothing more. Thus I have found myself falling into the DA community pit of creation. (Unknown to my girlfriend.) I don’t have an account myself because I just don’t consider myself artistic enough to bother posting anything I work on. But even so I’ve been there through alot of changes, as a shadow. I think DeviantART is a wonderful place. Giving those that create a virtual wall to hang and share their creations. But recently it’s become a lot more “mechanical” and less “human” It’s losing it’s soul. I’m not sure if this is due to you being fired or not. But it would seem so.
I guess my point is, I think you need to be slotted back into your position so DA can breathe again. Jark the anally-obsessed Alien is DA’s lil yellow mascot. It’s not truely DA without you.
If you go to court you’ll win. Nuff said.
Hit me back if you get time, i’d like to know how you’re coping.
-CT
I had never really heard much about this until I clicked a random link on someone’s profile. Its safe to say that I am genuinely interested in the situation now, and it seems rather bothersome. I do wish I knew the specifics on the situation, I wish I could pass proper judgement, but at the same time, I feel sympathy for you.
It is also unfortunate that I have no personal matters in this issue, but I trust that things will work out for you. I wish the best of luck in your coming ordeals, and I’ll try to send SOMETHING to help the cause.
Jark if it wasn’t for what you started when the community was first rising I wouldn’t of been interested and brought my friends to the site as well. I was not an active member when all the problems arised as i was getting ready for college and focusing on money issues. I am still confused as why you were terminated unwillingly, but i’m sure you feel like a broken record reiterating the truth so you don’t need to waste your time responding to me I just want to let you know the community furthermore is not real without you.
For all that it’s worth, I’m behind your case 100%.
Angelo has not taken into account the views of what matters, only what he wants.
I’ll help fight to the end.
Take care, Scott, and remember, the whole community will fight the corporation.
Take care,
-Joe
You deserve everything you got Jark. I suggest you deal with it. ;)
Termination for only a couple of questions?
Sounds like and excuse to get rid of youin my opinion
There isn’t much I can really say here since at this point in time life obviously sucks but the best advice I can give is to remember that when one door closes, another is opened. I am not going to comment on what Angelo did or anything since I am not big on the legal matters regarding this but just trying to say that life is always going to be full of many disappointments … some worse then others, but the key to get on and get passed it.
I wish you luck in the many opportunities life shall present you in the near future.
Hmm.. being active in terms of posting, inactive in terms of dA drama, I was shocked when I learned of all the outrageous events!
at first I read the links at bittertaste’s journal.. and I was so confused, I just closed the links after reading them and sat there for a moment pondering. And then it came up again but yesterday… and I come to see they fired you? That’s outrageous.
Sure, I don’t know the whole story, but that has got to be one of the most idiotic moves they could’ve made.
I’m getting very frustrated for my lack of knowledge on this subject. Because all I see is a rebellion I’d that seems to be for a worthy cause, yet, I do not know for what.
Oi.
what a sad year.
So This is total bull what they did. And if i could i’d resign from DA but it is my only means of exposure. if i get any money soon i’ll be sure to donate to your cause. I can only hope the suit doesn’t shut them down.
Well it has been a while that I have been active at devart, but while I was I loved it and thought that Jark was a great community leader. It really upsets me to see this. Best of luck to you Jark I wish you the best.
Could somebody explain?? What happened?!
I’ll support you, though, Jark.
Hey bro,
Dude thats a load of crap, i can just say that i’ve been in an almost similar situation and well since i was also a cofounder it was like having a giant knife being stabbed right between my sholderblades. I didn’t take it very well, i blew up in their faces telling them about all their mistakes and incompetence (which was true since they wern’t doing there jobs) and went out to get wasted, when i came home i then finished with nuking the site and shut them down. Now i’m not saying that you should kill DA but it will make you feel a whole lot better ;) dont take it to close to heart, just let them be the cowards they are and remember were all here for you man.
Regards,
-=Nick=-
Oh my ghaad. I’m sorry to say, this is the first I’ve heard of this, such has been my self-imposed seclusion (and my own involuntary termination from another site).
Dude, if there’s anything I can do to assist, say the word.
~ milla
OH NO!!! i always knew that there was something evil behind spyed,,, :(
- I wish I knew the full story…
I have taken on paranoia since the moment I registered on deviantART, originally due to copyright and related worries, and ‘rippers’.
But the outcome of this case will determine weather I remain a deviant, or rely on my personal gallery integrated into my folio.
The moment I read the words “civil war”, not even 3 weeks into my DA membership, I have been trying to find out as much as I could find, from many and any old journals I could find! - Failing miserably to get deaper. - although I have a real good guess on what this e-mail thing was all about.
- At the end of days Jark, the winner will arise!
- You are a talented yellow Alien, so remember that life is on your side!
- I will be watching your site, and DeviantART’s site, to determine weather I should continue my membership at DA.
The community of DA has Jark Stamps all over!
Its really cool that its been explaind to me in more detail now, the only things i’d read prior to this was the old, blue pill red pill one a pug and a yellow ailien blah that angelo sent to every one.
I hope i can get an email sent to you in the next few days but yer as far as the I support Jark stuff id be intrested in giving my support money wise, obviusly i think ill leave the email to do the talking.
This sort of thing happens a lot. Especially to those that are part of a union. When you start asking questions they get upset and move to eliminate the problem (i.e: you). It is, however, illegal for them to do so if it was only a conflict of issues. If this was the only event that led to your termination then you have a right to sue them silly. It’s a tough case (you have to prove a lot, though the witness in your conversation would be key, but if it’s worth it, I say give it a shot.
*Sigh* you did what you could…it just seems that they terminated you for trying to change problems stuff they didnt want to change for their benefit, its illegal. I guess thats the risk of having a site controlled by a board. But I’m sure you already know this. You know the entire story, do what you think is right. *hug for jark* ^_^
damn dude, I finally get back to DA and see you’re gone, who’m I gonna argue against injustice with now? xD
wtf?
this is dung! this is insanity!
they chucked you out for no-f*kin-god-damned reason!
and the fact that i’m an atheist makes injustice harder to bear!
fuck em jark m’man.
u’re bigger than this thing.
u’re bigger than the dA and the whole dragon-shit.
u’ll get out of this with your skin, mark my words.
I saw a change in deviantART staff a few weeks ago, but I had no idea you were gone. I got a couple of deletions for supposedly copyright violation, though the respective works were in the public domain (White House images are always in public domain, from my knowings). It seems that Angelo’s character (which resembles one of a stinking onion (I’m sure they’ll suspend my account if they see this)) has spread among the guys at devART. It’s really a shame that people like you must leave their own creations. I wish you luck in your trial and I hope something will be done regarding this situation. Sincerely, dankhus.
That sucks Jark. I’ve been active on DA almost daily since 2001, and it’s thanks to the efforts of you and a few others who made DA possible. I’ve kept a low profile and only spoken to you maybe once, but I was there doing my bit for DA the whole time. It’s absurd that they did this, and doesn’t speak well for the future of DA, which saddens me. Well, you created something that grew and became a huge collaboration between you and a community of users, so I hope that this accomplishment at least gives you great pleasure. Good luck on your future endeavors, I feel certain that with a bright mind like yours and the experience you’ve gained you have many options before you.
hey man,
i cant believe it, that the founder of http://www.deviantart.com has been terminated.
Its really sad what happened, and a creation of you that has been grown so big. it looks impossible.
i feel sorry what happened.
cheers, jaxe :(
I know I am really late at any sort of a reply to this, but I haven’t been to this lil’ site of your for a long white and found this just today, and had to respond.
Ever since your termination, I left DA. If there is a termination of the brains behind the whole site, which to me first off seems wrong to BEGIN with, and yet have it be too illegal to say to the public? Well it sounded fishy to me, and I didn’t feel I could trust my work on DA any longer.
So since then I really only use it as a blog truthfully. I use it also to look through the neat works like those whom I love to watch, but I rarely take part in the community anymore.
As soon as I heard you were terminated I actually did alot of research on Angelo, and did you know there are alot of websites with him where he is a founder, and quite a bit don’t even mention you as one. I saw that as a common thing, and it seemed bizzare to me, that soo many sites had the same errors over and over. Some even mentioned him as being the one and only founder. I kept all my searchings in a folder, and made a journal about it on DA.. I am not sure how many of the websites or interviews, etc are still active. It still seemed interesting to me.
I don’t know, I am horrible with the legal world. Maybe this is a common thing to happen? If you are interested in anything, feel free to Email me.
Best wishes to you. If I could I would send you money, but I have no job at the moment. I am still here to support you.
Jark, Scott, Yellow Alien…
Although this is a rather late reply to this topic, i figure that you deserve ongoing support from the community.
A community you put everything on the line for, a community that was built on the foundation of compassion and a community that misses their irreplaceable yellow alien.
I know this must be tough for you… heck, i can’t even imagine what you’re going through, all i know is that you will make it through.
I have never come across anyone with so much compassion as you have. Even through all that happened, you still have the courage to look the community in the eye, give them a smile and selflessly tell them that the community comes first.
You put your life on hold to build this community, your caring, friendly, supportive and enthusiastic nature is the reason it is so successful.
And when i say ’successful’ i DO NOT mean ‘makes shitloads of money’.
I mean something that has changed the lives of people from all over the world and has brought them together using the ONLY universal language… ART.
I cried when i first read about your termination some time ago. Cried for what you as a person have lost, cried for what the community has lost, and cried for the values the Board of Directors has lost.
You put yourself behind the community 100%. Not for personal gain, not for financial gain… But sheerly to see the community develop into something we can all be proud of…
And we are Jark - we’re proud of the community. You’ve created a utopia where people of all backgrounds, races and countries can be equal.
No politician has ever achieved that. Nor has any celebrity, sporting star or otherwise.
YOU have changed the lives of so many people for the better, NO-ONE CAN EVER, OR WILL EVER, CHANGE THAT!
The new administration might be able to take away your status as an administrator, but they will never take away our support.
Just remember when things are getting you down - You have created something that has changed the lives of MILLIONS of people (for the better).
And THAT, my dearest yellow alien, is more than most people can even dream of accomplishing in a LIFETIME - let alone 6 years.
Well, I think this isn’t as big of a deal now because, I’m looking at your devaintART page and it claims that you are indeed someone of authority. It does NOT say you’re an admin, but even better, in my own opion, it states that you’re a Co-Founder. And not to forg